igor:
i take a pick at this board ones in a while but in those few times I look here Mr. Matthesson's postings contained mostly insults. Maybe I missed his other more positive postings or maybe not.

Thanks

Drake There were no positive postings

Russians are skrewed up again, and again, and again... They shoot at each other there. As usual. Good luck in Stalingrad, liberators, there are many rakes around waiting for you.

MK

ÑÏÅÖØÒÓÐÌ

Ãðîçíûé áåðóò ñ “îïðåäåëåííûì” óñïåõîì
Êàëèíèíà Þëèÿ
Âåðòîëåò óæå ãîòîâ áûë ëåòåòü â Ìîçäîê ñ ïåðåäîâîé, îòêóäà âîéñêà ñåé÷àñ âåäóò íàñòóïëåíèå íà Ãðîçíûé.  ïîñëåäíèé ìîìåíò ê îòêðûòîìó ëþêó ïîäáåæàë âîåííûé ñ áåëîé ïîâÿçêîé íà ðóêàâå è ñòàë ÷òî-òî êðè÷àòü, óêàçûâàÿ ðóêîé íàçàä. Ëåò÷èê êèâíóë. Íåñìîòðÿ íà òî ÷òî óæå òåìíåëî è ïî ìåñòíûì ïðàâèëàì íàäî áûëî ñðî÷íî óëåòàòü, âåðòîëåò îñòàëñÿ æäàòü. "Ðàíåíûå!" — êðèêíóë íåïîíÿòíî êîìó êîìàíäèð ýêèïàæà, îáåðíóâøèñü â ãðîõî÷óùèé ñàëîí âåðòîëåòà.
Èõ ïðèâåçëè â ãðóçîâèêå ìèíóò ÷åðåç 10. ×åòâåðî ðåáÿò â ÷åðíûõ øàïî÷êàõ, çàæàâ óøè ðóêàìè, çàëåçëè íà áîðò, íî ñèäåòü ñïîêîéíî îíè íå ìîãëè. Èõ êðþ÷èëî îò áîëè, è îíè ñòàðàëèñü çàñóíóòü ñâîè ãîëîâû êóäà-íèáóäü ïîãëóáæå. Òå, êòî ñèäåë â âåðòîëåòå, áðîñèëèñü ïîìîãàòü, çàæèìàòü èì óøè âîðîòíèêàìè áóøëàòîâ, óòåøàòü, ïèõàòü êàêèå-òî òàáëåòêè.
Êîíòóçèÿ. Ñòðàøíàÿ ãîëîâíàÿ áîëü, òîøíîòà, ãîëîâîêðóæåíèå. Îò ãðîìêîãî çâóêà âñå ýòî óñóãóáëÿåòñÿ — ðåâ âåðòîëåòíîãî äâèãàòåëÿ äëÿ êîíòóæåííîãî êàê ñîëü íà ðàíó.
Áîëü íàêàòûâàåò ïðèñòóïàìè. Êîãäà îòïóñêàåò, áîåö, ñèäÿùèé ðÿäîì ñî ìíîé, ïûòàåòñÿ óëûáàòüñÿ, íî ïîëó÷àåòñÿ ñêîðåå íå óëûáêà, à îñêàë. Îí âñå õî÷åò îáúÿñíèòü ìíå, êàê ïîëó÷èëîñü, ÷òî èõ êîíòóçèëî.  êîíöå êîíöîâ ìíå óäàåòñÿ ïîíÿòü, ÷òî ïàðíè èç ñïåöíàçà âíóòðåííèõ âîéñê — áðèãàäà èç Ìèíåðàëüíûõ Âîä. Ñåãîäíÿ óòðîì èõ áðîñèëè â Ãðîçíûé. È ïîñêîëüêó îíè ñïåöíàç, èì äàëè ñïåöçàäàíèå.
Ïÿòüþ ÷àñàìè ðàíüøå â Ãðîçíûé âîøëè ðàçâåäïîäðàçäåëåíèÿ âíóòðåííèõ âîéñê è ïîïàëè â çàñàäó. Ñïåöíàçó áûëî ïðèêàçàíî èõ âûòàùèòü. "Ñíàéïåðû â êàæäîì äîìå, — ðàññêàçûâàåò êîíòóæåííûé áîåö, — íî ìû ïðîïîëçëè, âûòàùèëè îäíîãî ðàçâåä÷èêà. Ïîòîì ïîïîëçëè çà äðóãèì — åìó íîãè îòîðâàëî. È òóò ïðÿìî ïî íàì óäàðèë àðìåéñêèé òàíê".
Ãðóïïó ñïåöíàçîâöåâ ðàçìåòàëî, êòî-òî, âèäèìî, ïîãèá. Íåñêîëüêî ÷åëîâåê ñìîãëè äîáåæàòü äî ñâîèõ.  èòîãå ÷åòâåðî êîíòóæåííûõ — ñàìûå ëåãêî ïîñòðàäàâøèå. Òÿæåëûõ îòïðàâèëè ñ ïåðåäîâîé ñðàçó â Ðîñòîâ, íà îïåðàöèîííûé ñòîë.
— Ñëóøàé, à ãäå íàøè àâòîìàòû? — âäðóã ñïîõâàòûâàåòñÿ îäèí ñïåöíàçîâåö. Íå äàé áîã ñîëäàòó ïîòåðÿòü ñâîå îðóæèå — ïîä òðèáóíàë ïîéäåøü.
— Ñäàëè, — óñïîêàèâàåò åãî äðóãîé. — Ïðàâäà, ïîñëå òàíêà ìîé "êàëàø" óæå âñå ðàâíî íå ñòðåëÿë.
— À ÿ åùå îòñòðåëèâàëñÿ, êîãäà óõîäèëè, — âñïîìèíàåò ïåðâûé.
Íî íà íèõ îïÿòü íàêàòûâàåò äóðíîòà, îíè ñíîâà êîð÷àòñÿ è çàæèìàþò óøè.
— Ñêàæèòå èì, íàäî àâèàöèåé! — êðè÷èò ìíå â óõî ñîñåä, ñòàðàÿñü ïåðåêðè÷àòü øóì. — Ñêàæèòå, íàäî áîìáèòü. À òî îíè íàñ òóäà çàãíàëè íà óíè÷òîæåíèå. Òàì íå ïðîéòè. Âñþäó ñíàéïåðû, à òóò åùå ñâîè ëóïÿò.
...Ñóäÿ ïî îòðûâî÷íûì îòçûâàì áîéöîâ è ìëàäøèõ êîìàíäèðîâ, â ïîíåäåëüíèê âîéñêà â Ãðîçíûé âîéòè òàê è íå ñìîãëè. Âî âñÿêîì ñëó÷àå, ñî ñòîðîíû Ñòàðîïðîìûñëîâñêîãî øîññå. Òàêòèêà ó ÷å÷åíñêèõ áîåâèêîâ ïðåæíÿÿ. Ñíà÷àëà îíè íå îêàçûâàþò ñîïðîòèâëåíèÿ è ïðîïóñêàþò ïîäðàçäåëåíèÿ âïåðåä, à ïîòîì ñòàðàþòñÿ âçÿòü åãî â êîëüöî è óíè÷òîæèòü.  ðåçóëüòàòå áîéöû âûíóæäåíû îòñòóïàòü, ïðîðûâàÿ îáîðîíó è íåñÿ áîëüøèå ïîòåðè.
Ïî ñëîâàì ãëàââðà÷à ãîñïèòàëÿ ÌÂÄ, îí ïðèíèìàë ðàíåíûõ äî ÷åòûðåõ óòðà, è â êîíöå êîíöîâ îêàçàëîñü, ÷òî ó íåãî íà 70 êîåê 123 ðàíåíûõ...
Âïðî÷åì, çàìåñòèòåëü êîìàíäóþùåãî âíóòðåííèìè âîéñêàìè ãåíåðàë Ñòàíèñëàâ Êàâóí ñêàçàë ìíå, ÷òî îïðåäåëåííûé óñïåõ ñïåöîïåðàöèè âñå æå äîñòèãíóò, óäàëîñü â ãîðîä âîéòè è çàêðåïèòüñÿ. Íî ïîòåðè âíóòðåííèõ âîéñê áîëüøèå — 12 ÷åëîâåê ïîãèáøèõ è 40 ðàíåíûõ...

Ãðîçíûé — Ìîçäîê

A little history on Chechnen Republic:

In March 1992, a constitution was adopted, defining the Chechen Republic as an independent, secular state governed by a president and a parliament.

In 1994, Russia sent troops to Chechnya to crush the independence movement of President Dzhokhar Dudayev.

Russian troops moved into the capital, Grozny, after a bombardment that reduced it to ruins. But they could not hold the city against a committed Chechnen Army.

Kidnappings in Chechnya have been partially attributed to Russian secret police intent on upsetting the government.

I have to say that given the situation of a large and corrupt Russian bureaucracy in conflict with a country with a population of one million, one hundred thousand of which were killed during the last Russian war, I have to side with the underdog.

Balalaika
bud' ti prokliat, ubliudok.

2 Caucasian,

Kotira koso.

Saul:
With all due respect, where did you get this information? I would like to take a look at the source.

Goverment of Dudaev was never recognize by Russian federation or UN. There are no prove that kidnapping is a work of russian secret police. For that matter this is first time I hear this statement.

Please, let me know the source

Thanks

Balalka:
my browser does not support the font you are using. Can you provide the information on this font or type whole message in standart font.

thanks

Saul:
I am quite sure who the underdog is in this situation. It is the simple citizen of russian federation (this includes chechnya). These are the people who must leave the homes because of war, conscripts who fight the war and so forth. These does not include the so called chechen "freedoom" fighters who kidnap, kill, traffic drugs, russian politicians who advocates war in order to stay in power.

Thanks

2 drake,

This was an article from Russian newspaper. The text is in Russian. On my Explorer 5.0 I use build-in Cyrillic (Windows) fonts.

What a level! The "Moskovsky Konsomoletz" (pardon), a pro-Moscow Mayor roll. Couldn't You find something more credible, than this leftover wrapping material and a waste of trees of a paper, known (and despised for it) for printing everything to please this hog (dreaming of grabbing Kremlin power) wanted to answer very uneasy questions before the Arizona court?

Drake:

The source of this information is the BBC News:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/europe/newsid_460000/460399.stm

But really, let us not get hung up on specific facts. The real underlying cause of the war is oil = money. Here is a quote from a 1998 article about the oil pipeline to be built through Chechnya:

Moscow's route (oil pipeline) goes directly through troubled Dagestan and Chechnya, the rebellious Caucasian republic that has defeated the Russian Army and descended into violent anarchy.
Russian and Chechen spokesmen promise that the oil will flow, whatever the state of their relations, because neither side can afford to spurn the lucrative transport fees. In late April, officials signed an agreement that would pay Chechnya $3.58 per ton (50 barrels) of oil crossing its territory through the present pipeline.


Oil is name of the game in the area, and Russia wants total control without having to split the profit with the Chechnens.

Drake

Somehow they are using CYRILIC( WINDOWs-1251) encoding instead of UNICODE.
You may go to VIEW - ENCODING to set it up in NETSCAPE browser.
By the way, most the time it is good only to refresh one's four letter words in Russian.
That's why I peek here from time to time.

I believe the board's IP is on the US soil, where any kind of physical thread by phone, e-mail etc is a federal offence (3 years and up in a slammer, no excuses or exceptions). "Urki" do not care.

2 Saul,

Was importance in 1998. But in 1999 and in the forthcoming 2000 more relevant reasons are Russian elections, first to DUMB, oops, to DUMA, and then - presidential one next year. You may remember that Russian previos war in Chechnya was also just before elections. Wars in Russia have become cyclical....

Saul:
I agree on oil issue with you. Nevertheless, I think oil is important to both sides. I do not believe that Dudaev would want to declare independence (not referendum but he declared it himself) if there were no oil in that area. I think Dudaev wanted to have more oil to himself so he declared independece.

"Russian and chechen spokesmen pormised to ...." in this case, why did Basayev invaded into Dagestan and issued the statement declaring whole Caucaus region to be independent (again without referndum) Anyone would know that Russian federation would not let it happen without war. This would led to cancelation of whole deal. So this war is not in interest of Russian federation

what do you think
thanks