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June 28, 2000 11:24 pm
THIRD SECRET "COMMENTARY" RAISES CONCERNS OVER "WHITEWASH"
FORT ERIE, ONTARIO -June 27 -The Fatima Center described the Vatican’s interpretation of the Third Secret of Fatima as a “whitewash,” in comments today by Father Paul Kramer, a Catholic priest at the Center.
“The vision described in the text is a scene in which the Pope is shot dead by soldiers, and then bishops, priests and so forth are killed in the same way, one by one, after they have all gone through a half-ruined city. This clearly has nothing to do with Pope John Paul II not being shot dead by Ali Agca,” said Father Kramer.
“Furthermore,” said Father Kramer, “the Vatican’s own official booklet containing the text of Sister Lucia’s vision demolishes the Vatican’s claim, via Cardinal Ratzinger’s commentary, that the Secret relates only to 20th Century events culminating in the 1981 assassination attempt.” Father Kramer was referring to a letter by Sister Lucia to the Pope on May 12, 1982, which was published in the Vatican’s official booklet on the Secret. The letter, written one year less a day after the assassination, states regarding the Secret: “And if we have not yet seen the complete fulfillment of the final part of this prophecy, we are going towards it little by little with great strides if we do not reject the path of sin . . .”
Father Kramer continued: “If Sister Lucia told the Pope, a year after the attempt on his life, that the prophecy of the Secret is not yet fulfilled, and that we are going toward its fulfillment in great strides because of sin in the world, how can the Vatican possibly say that the vision in the Secret describes the assassination attempt a year earlier? Sister Lucia made no such connection in her letter to the Pope, which does not even mention the assassination attempt. The Vatican’s interpretation has no support in either the text of the vision or Sister Lucia’s understanding of the Secret as expressed in her 1982 letter to the Pope. In short, we are looking at a whitewash of the Third Secret.”
“There is another serious question regarding the Vatican interpretation,” said Father Kramer. “The Vatican’s official booklet notes that Sister Lucia’s memoirs containing the words of Our Lady in the first two parts of the Secret end with the crucial phrase ‘In Fatima the dogma of the Faith will always be preserved, etc. . . .’ That phrase just hangs there, out of all context with the previous paragraphs, leading everyone to assume that the thought would be completed in the text of the Third and final part of the Secret, following the ‘etc.’”
Father Kramer noted that, contrary to all expectations, the text of the Third Secret contains no further words of Our Lady of Fatima. “It seems difficult to believe that the spoken words of Our Lady of Fatima end with the ambiguous ‘etc.’ Where is the rest of what Our Lady of Fatima had to say?” Father Kramer further noted that the Vatican’s notice in 1960 regarding its decision to suppress publication of the Secret in that year referred specifically to the decision not to reveal “the words of Our Lady” contained in the text of the Secret. “But the text of the Third Secret released yesterday contains no words of Our Lady at all. This raises a serious question in the minds of many people.”
Father Kramer added that the Vatican commentary makes no reference to the Conversion of Russia predicted in the first two parts of the Secret. “The conversion of Russia is identified by Our Lady of Fatima as the very Triumph of Her Immaculate Heart, the focal point of the Message of Fatima. Amazingly, the Ratzinger commentary on the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart in the Vatican booklet on the Secret makes no reference whatever to the conversion of Russia to the Catholic Faith. This conversion of Russia has apparently been written out of the Message of Fatima, never to be mentioned again by the Vatican. Meanwhile, the abortion rate has soared in Russia, its government is dominated by atheistic ‘ex-communists’ and recycled KGB agents, and Russian society is falling to pieces.”
Father Kramer drew a link between yesterday’s publication of the Secret and a Vatican news conference today at which Vatican Secretary of State, Angelo Cardinal Sodano, and Mikhail Gorbachev spoke to the press regarding the memoirs of the late Secretary of State, Cardinal Casaroli, entitled “The Martyrdom of Patience: 1963 to 1989.” Casaroli’s memoirs defend the Secretary of State’s policy of Ostpolitik or silence and non-confrontation toward communist regimes which oppress Catholics.
Father Kramer continued: “It seems that the Vatican’s ‘spin’ is that Ostpolitik has brought about the supposed ‘fall of communism’ and that this merely political event is the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart, leading to a brave new world of brotherhood represented by people like Gorbachev. But the Gorbachev Foundation promotes reduction of the world’s population through contraception and abortion. It is a disgrace that this pro-abortion, one-world government globalist was made a guest of honor at the Vatican one day after we are told about the Third Secret. This is a gross insult to the Blessed Virgin.”
Father Kramer observed that no questions were permitted during the Gorbachev/Sodano news conference. “Whoever heard of a press conference at which the press is not allowed to ask any questions? Clearly, the Vatican press office did not wish anyone in the audience to spoil the illusion that the Message of Fatima has been fulfilled with the ‘fall of communism,’ and that people like Gorbachev represent the promising new future of mankind.”
The Fatima Center will issue a more complete statement regarding the Secret within “a short time” said Father Nicholas Gruner, head of the Center. “Cardinal Ratzinger said the Church is not imposing any particular interpretation of the Third Secret, but rather that he is merely offering a comment. This was a very prudent disclaimer, because the interpretation offered by the Vatican yesterday raises far more questions than it answers.”
Contact Father Nicholas Gruner
The Fatima Centre, 452 Kraft Road, Fort Erie, Ontario L2A 4M7
(905) 871-7607, Ext. 103.
The Fatima Center, home of “The Fatima Crusader,” is the world’s largest Fatima apostolate campaigning for the promotion of the full Message of Fatima, for the release of the Third Secret and for the Consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. Its outreach includes the print media, Internet, radio and television. For more information on the Third Secret, and on (1) What Pope John Paul II and Cardinal Oddi said previously about its content, (2) Statements of Father Joseph de Sainte-Marie and Bishop Graber on the obligation to obey the Fatima Message, (3) An interview with Father Kramer that explains the necessity of releasing a photographic reproduction of Sister Lucia’s original 1944 handwritten text of the Third Secret, (4) A factual account of the October 13, 1917, Miracle of the Sun -- Visit http://www.fatima.org
June 29, 2000 12:39 am
WARSAW'S DEMOCRACY FORUM CONDEMNS WAR IN CHECHNYA
The Warsaw non-governmental forum on democracy--a parallel event to the conference on democracy--has condemned Russia for the war in Chechnya and called for an immediate cease- fire and peace negotiations. The statement was signed by 165 out of the 264 participants in the forum. A Russian delegate, Sergei Markov of the Institute of Political Studies in Moscow, called the statement a "big political mistake," objecting especially to a clause saying that Russia "should have no place in the Community of Democracies" if the war continues, according to AP.
June 29, 2000 2:29 am
Antonio I have to tell you that Russia will never,never convert to Catholisism.I can absolutly assure you of that fact.What in the world can Catholisism give us that our own religion does not?And Saladin who really cares what some idiots in Poland say?
June 29, 2000 3:24 am
>>>By IGOR ( - 149.99.72.182) on Thursday, June 29, 2000 - 02:29 am:
Antonio I have to tell you that Russia will never,never convert to Catholisism.I can absolutly assure you of that fact.What in the world can Catholisism give us that our own religion does not?>>>
Igor, I agree with you on both counts.
Firstly, Russia will never convert to Catholism, because Russians will convert to Islam.
Secondly, Catholisism can not give anything more than your current religion. Both of them are far away from the Jesus's teachings, as such they led you astray.
Topic starter
June 29, 2000 3:38 am
Turkish men are fags, and here is the proof.
(In addition to the Turkish male belly dancers)
AZERBAIJAN LIFTS BAN ON SEX BETWEEN MEN
MEDIA RELEASE BY ILGA-EUROPE
Gay activists in Azerbaijan report that the ban on sexual relationships between men in that country has been lifted. A special edition of "Azerbaijan", the official newspaper of the Parliament, published on 28 May, reports that the Parliament has approved a new Criminal Code, and that the President has signed a decree bringing it
into force in September. The text of the new Criminal Code is also published. From this it is clear that the old Article 113 (inherited From the Soviet era, and which punished anal sex between men with three years imprisonment) has been replaced with a new Article 150, which bans only forcible sexual acts.
Azerbaijan has applied for membership of the Council of Europe, and the Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe is due to vote on its application on Wednesday 28 June. The introduction of the new Criminal Code is part of the widespread legal and institutional reforms undertaken by Azerbaijan in order to bring its institutions up to the standards required by the Council of Europe. These standards include the abolition of laws which ban same-sex relationships.
ILGA Europe has been campaigning for the last 18 months to ensure that Article 113 is repealed as a condition of membership of the Council of Europe. Last month a Committee of the Parliamentary Assembly proposed that acceptance of Azerbaijan's membership on 28 June be made subject to a specific obligation to repeal Article 113.
Nico Beger, ILGA-Europe co-delegate to the Council of Europe, commented: "This is very good news. Article 113 created real problems for gay people, particularly through extortion by corrupt police officers."
Her co-delegate Nigel Warner added: "Since the historic ruling by the European Court of Human Rights in the Dudgeon case in 1981 some 22
countries and territories in Europe have repealed laws banning gay relationships. In the whole of Europe only Armenia, the Republika Srpska entity of Bosnia Hercegovina and the Chechen Republic still maintain such laws".
THE INTERNATIONAL LESBIAN AND GAY ASSOCIATION
The International Lesbian and Gay Association is a world-wide federation of 350 national and local groups dedicated to achieving equal rights for lesbians, gay men, bisexuals and transgendered people everywhere.
THE COUNCIL OF EUROPE
The Council of Europe's main role is to strengthen democracy, human rights and the rule of law throughout its member states. Founded
in the wake of the Second World War, it is the continent's most important human rights organisation, with some 41 member states
committed to observing its human rights standards.
The European Convention on Human Rights is the most significant of its many human rights treaties. The European Court of Human Rights settles complaints of violations of this Convention.
The Council of Europe is governed by the Foreign Ministers of its member states (who together form its decision-making body, the "Committee of Ministers") and by Representatives from their
parliaments (who make up its "Parliamentary Assembly".) More information on the Council can be obtained from its website, www.coe.fr
NB: The Council of Europe is not the same as the European Union, which is primarily an economic institution, comprising 15 West European member states
June 29, 2000 3:46 am
>>>By Antonio ( - 209.239.214.89) on Thursday, June 29, 2000 - 03:38 am:
Turkish men are fags, and here is the proof.
(In addition to the Turkish male belly dancers)
AZERBAIJAN LIFTS BAN ON SEX BETWEEN MEN >>>
Antonio is on his way to AZERBAIJAN. LOL.
Topic starter
June 29, 2000 3:49 am
By IGOR ( - 149.99.72.182) on Thursday, June 29, 2000 - 02:29 am:
>Antonio I have to tell you that Russia will
>never,never convert to Catholisism.I can
>absolutly assure you of that fact.What in the
>world can Catholisism give us that our own
>religion does not?And Saladin who really cares
>what some idiots in Poland say?
If Russia is not converted to Catholicism, then Russia will destroy the world (which, according to Our Lady of Fatima (the Virgin Mary), deserves the chastisement of God). Thus, Russia has been designated by God to be His instrument of chastisement of the world, and if the world does not want to receive the punishment it rightfully deserves for its sins, then it should demand the Pope and all the Catholic bishops Consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary.
Catholicism cannot give Russia anything from the world, but what it can give Russia is the grace blessings and eternal salvation that comes from Heaven.
So, until the Catholic bishops and Pope give the Consecration to Russia, I would say to the Russians - hurry up and invade the U.S. and Western Europe! Teach those upstart Albanians a lesson! Nuke England! Use Neutron Bombs on the Turks!
Topic starter
June 29, 2000 4:05 am
By Turk ( - 210.23.129.62) on Thursday, June 29, 2000 - 03:46 am:
>>>By Antonio ( - 209.239.214.89) on Thursday, June 29, 2000 - 03:38 am:
Turkish men are fags, and here is the proof.
(In addition to the Turkish male belly dancers)
>AZERBAIJAN LIFTS BAN ON SEX BETWEEN MEN >>>
>Antonio is on his way to AZERBAIJAN. LOL.
I have already been on what the Turks say is "Azeri terrortory". I was in Nagorno Karabakh in 1992 and 1993. Ahh, Lachin, what a beautiful city in the mountains, emptied of all the Azeris. Ahhh Shushi and Maghavooz and Lyoolasaz and Kyalbajar, where the air is fresh and the sweet tart arromatic grapes on the eaves of the balconies tingle the tongue. Ahh the sweet aroma of gunpowder from AK-74 ammo in the morning. Oh, I forgot to mention the deserted houses in Lisakor with pictures of Turki mamas hanging in the living rooms. Yeah, take that Turki house floors for firewood to heat up the tushenka and borsch. And what is that stuff called that the Russian soldiers in my platoon were drinking
made with the equivalent of 50 teabags in one liter of boiling water. Made my hair stand on end. I'll never forget all the Turkish POWs I met. One of them had gangrene. He was a diehard Mohammedan, but he read 5 times front to back a Bible which I gave him. Yeah Turk, I'll go to Azerbaijan again - with a bulimyote in one hand and an granadamyote in the other and the next time we will move beyond Aghdam, Fizouli and Chebrail. Next stop - Baku! After that - Ankara!
June 29, 2000 4:15 am
>>>By Hairy Mary ( - 216.34.56.10) on Wednesday, June 28, 2000 - 12:15 pm:
TURK
I agree, indeed there is good and bad elements within any society and generalizations cannot be made by the actions of some. >>>
HM,
Thanks for agreeing with me in the principle.
I think media is (perhaps deliberately) confusing the actions of a few desperate (and/or criminal) people with Islam.
Some nominal Islamic societies have a lot of traditions, and customs, which have nothing to do with Islamic teaching. This is similar to other societies. (Ask Antonio, he keeps complaining in how far everyone deviated from Catholisism!)
I hope to be an islamic fundamentalist, meaning that I am striving to understand and apply Islam as free from deviations as possible, within the spirit of the Quran and the prophet Mohammad's teachings. Being a fundamentalist has nothing to do with killing and raping other people in the name of Jihad.
Don't forget Islam is the same religion of the Moses and Jesus. Please see the following. Is it similar to what you already know from Bible?
002.047 O Children of Israel! Remember My favour wherewith I favoured you and how I preferred you to (all) creatures.
002.048 And guard yourselves against a day when no soul will in aught avail another, nor will intercession be accepted from it, nor will compensation be received from it, nor will they be helped.
002.049 And (remember) when We did deliver you from Pharaoh's folk, who were afflicting you with dreadful torment, slaying your sons and sparing your women: that was a tremendous trial from your Lord.
002.050 And when We brought you through the sea and rescued you, and drowned the folk of Pharaoh in your sight.
002.051 And when We did appoint for Moses forty nights (of solitude), and then ye chose the calf, when he had gone from you, and were wrong-doers.
002.052 Then, even after that, We pardoned you in order that ye might give thanks.
002.053 And when We gave unto Moses the Scripture and the criterion (of right and wrong), that ye might be led aright.
002.054 And when Moses said unto his people: O my people! Ye have wronged yourselves by your choosing of the calf (for worship) so turn in penitence to your Creator, and kill (the guilty) yourselves. That will be best for you with your Creator and He will relent toward you. Lo! He is the Relenting, the Merciful.
002.055 And when ye said: O Moses! We will not believe in thee till we see Allah plainly; and even while ye gazed the lightning seized you.
002.056 Then We revived you after your extinction, that ye might give thanks.
002.057 And We caused the white cloud to overshadow you and sent down on you the manna and the quails, (saying): Eat of the good things wherewith We have provided you - they wronged Us not, but they did wrong themselves.
June 29, 2000 4:20 am
By Antonio ( - 209.239.214.89) on Thursday, June 29, 2000 - 04:05 am:
Yeah Turk, I'll go to Azerbaijan again - with a bulimyote in one hand and an granadamyote in the other and the next time we will move beyond Aghdam, Fizouli and Chebrail. Next stop - Baku! After that - Ankara! >>>
Antonio,
I admire your imagination. As long as it makes you feel happy, nothing is wrong with it.
June 29, 2000 4:33 am
>>>Official Russian figures put its total losses at more than 2,300 since troops repelled an incursion by Chechen rebels into a neighboring region last August, ahead of the full-scale Chechen military campaign.>>>
Hmmm. That means Russian losses is more than 11,500 dead. This is a lot worse than first Chechen, and Afghanistan wars. No wonder Gennady Troshev is desperate to get his troops out of Chechnia.
June 29, 2000 5:43 am
ANTONIO
I'm not being sarcastic...GREAT STUFF TODAY, QUITE INFORMATIVE & INTERESTING READING.
June 29, 2000 6:25 am
WELL pisser, mean WISHER
Are you another one of the denial mode idiots? Can you say that the crimes against humanity committed by the MENTALIST did not occur? Are we to assume that you feel no shame for the way the MENTALIST kidnapped, tortured, maimed, raped and murdered innocent passengers on aircraft and an ocean liner in the name of ALLAH? Not to mention blowing up aircraft on the ground as well as in flight. REAL HERO's.
Can you say that the crimes committed by the MENTALIST were guided by the Quran? Doubtful, therefore, why do the MENTALIST consider there actions to be the will of ALLAH? I'll tell you why, because these farcan, hatemongoring, MENTALIST cowards have pure hate in their blood for Western people and will use and continue to use religion as an excuse to vent their and frustrations, jelousy not to mention the and surpression and abuse women as if their third class citizens.
They have brought nothing but undeniable shame to the faithful within the Muslim faith.
Before, you start making false accusations and feeble name calling directed at me I suggest that you open you eyes and feeble mind to reality.
Have you decided what you want to be when you grow up? Yes Father, I want to learn how to be a MENTALIST so that I can rape, torture, blowup people and airplanes also murder, kidnap, mame and ransom innocent HUMAN BEINGS.
ps: Idiot, I'm refering to (modern history and events) not ancient history. I formulate my opionions after reviewing evidence from both sides. Try it, you'd be amazed at the end result. You might also want to get some education.
June 29, 2000 6:46 am
NOW THAT I'M WARMED UP...WHERE'S QUEEN ALLAM?
June 29, 2000 7:31 am
>>>By Well Wisher ( - 152.163.197.62) on Thursday, June 29, 2000 - 04:56 am:
To Turk,
You sound like a reasonably intelligent person.
My advice to you is to ignore the rantings of that pathetic woman calling herself Hairy Mary. >>>
Well thank you Well Wisher. Now I know that I am a reasonably intelligent person. Not too much, not too little, just reasonable.
Let me make my own decisions as a grown up man.
Keep in mind that I did not become Muslim just because my tribe was Muslim, but been converted, so I find some of the attitudes of my Muslim brothers more offensive to my religion than what Hairy Mary can possibly do.
It is difficult to know exactly who is who, and what their motives are in the internet domain, but I find Hairy Mairy as an interesting, kind person. Whatever faults she has, and whatever mistakes she makes is her business. If someone does not like it, they are entitled to ignore her, I guess.
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